Owen County Blue Tongue Update

[hoosier]

A DNR worker confirmed his personally seeing 15 dead deer due to EHD. He said he has stopped responding to calls. Today I found fresh deer bones the dog had dragged to the yard. The neighboring pond had 3 deer dead in it. Motorists had stopped just West of Spencer to observe a deer that had been running in circles on Highway 46. The deer layed down and the 2 men were able to walk up to it and saw blood from the mouth/nostrils area. All of this and probably some I have forgotten were reported by good sources to me today alone! My friend near Cory also found 2 does dead where earlier he had found the huge buck I reported about in another thread. Truly disgusting if you ask me. What a miserable death to endure! ................................................................................................................Hey Woody......How about an EHD (Blue-tongue) update STICKY?

P.S., a local wildlife enthusiast suspects that for each dead deer found, another 9 probably are dead and unfound. Makes a person wonder.

[DEERTRACKS]

SAD!!!!!!!!!

[hunter480]

Woody-Who could we contact at the DNR to ask about some sort of statement-I`m sure others have questions like I do-such as, is this EHD? Does the DNR have any idea how badly this may have hit the herd? Are we likely to continue to find affected deer while bow hunting? Gun Hunting? What do we do if we believe we kill a sick deer? Are there obvious signs for an animal that may not be so far advanced that it displays the bleeding from the nose/mouth, weak, disoriented?

Others probably have questions I haven`t thought of yet, but it would be great to have a comprehensive list of Q and A.

[DaWG]

Greg you make some good points. I would support someone taking the point position on this and contact the DNR. I do not hunt in Owen County, but I don't how widespread the problem is perceived to be.

Lot's of questions here.

DaWG

[jkd]

I sent an e-mail to Jim Mitchell and will let you know if/when I hear something back from him...

[hoosier]

jkd, thanks for your involvement. Please let us know what is said. A neighbor of a sheriff's deputy here in Owen county found 2 dead does in a creek on their property about 2 miles North of Spencer yesterday evening. Also, a man I work with reports that Vermillion county is being hit hard as well. One property owner there discovered twenty deer dead on his large property. I share many of the same questions as many here. A main one is...are their indications of disease in a deer during the early stages of EHD...and...is the meat really okay to consume? Thanks to Woody for this new category too.

[mbogo]

hunter480 said:

Woody-Who could we contact at the DNR to ask about some sort of statement-I`m sure others have questions like I do-such as, is this EHD? Does the DNR have any idea how badly this may have hit the herd? Are we likely to continue to find affected deer while bow hunting? Gun Hunting? What do we do if we believe we kill a sick deer? Are there obvious signs for an animal that may not be so far advanced that it displays the bleeding from the nose/mouth, weak, disoriented?

Others probably have questions I haven`t thought of yet, but it would be great to have a comprehensive list of Q and A.

Until an official response is forthcoming here is what I remember of the official statements from last time:

Finding dead deer near water is a classic indicator of EHD as well as the other symptoms mentioned.

Deer will continue dieing until a hard frost kills the flys that transmit the disease.

Swollen joints in the leg just above the hooves can be a sign that the animal has EHD or has survived it.

Animals with EHD are safe for human consumption.

How badly this will hit the herd depends on the timing of the first hard frost and how widespread the outbreaks are.

[cambygsp]

www.wthitv.com/dsp_story.cfm?storyid=57881

Deer Hunters Facing Problem Before Season Even Starts
Dated: 09/21/2006 6:42:00 AM Updated: 09/21/2006 06:47:44 AM

By: Kelly Gillespie

Hunters in the Wabash Valley are preparing for the upcoming hunting season, but there's one problem. What they're hunting is dying, even before the season even starts.

Wildlife specialists say, in Putman, Parke, Owen, Clay, and Vermillion counties, deer are dying from an incurable virus referred to as Blue Tongue or "E-H-D".

The disease is spread by insects known as Midges. Officials say the virus is only harmful to deer and can "not" be spread to humans, even when handling or eating the meat.

The D-N-R says the first frost will stop the disease from spreading.

[jkd]

Here's the reply I got from Jim...

-------------------------------------------------------------

Since we can only get usable samples for a few hours after a deer dies, we would ask hunters to only report mortality where the deer is near water, has no visible wounds & is believed to only be dead for 2-4 hours. In such cases we ask hunters to contact their district biologist (number available in hunt guide) or call the deer hotline [phone].

-------------------------------------------------------------

I also spoke with my dad, retired IDNR wildlife disease specialist with 35 years in the field, and he indicated that if someone finds several dead deer which have clearly not been shot, especially near water, that the hunter should go ahead and report the find/location even if it's beyond the 4 hour limit that Jim references. That would enable IDNR to track the spread, and even after that time frame, other post-mortem signs could still verify EHD as the likely cause of death.

He also indicated that deer go to water as a result of the high fever and thirst associated with the disease, and are often so weak they can't get back out of the creek or pond, which is why so many are often found in the water. He said that when he was working, they once found over a hundred dead deer at Kingsbury in and around the water. The midge (biting fly) is the carrier, hence references to a hard killing frost stopping the outbreak once the flies are dead.

Would be a good idea for everyone to locate the district biologist phone info for their area from the hunting guide and store it in their cell for use in the field if they find dead deer while hunting.

Here's some sites with EHD info:

www.pgc.state.pa.us/pgc/cwp/view.asp?A=11&Q=157405

wdfw.wa.gov/factshts/ehd.htm

www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10370_12150_12220-26647--,00.html

[hunter480]

I want to second the thanks to Woody and jkd-for making EHD it`s own thread and contacting Jim Mitchell, respectively. Thanks guys-and keep the information coming.

[hoosier]

Today's edition of the Spencer newspaper had a 2 page article titled "EHD responsible for recent state and local whitetail deaths". In it Jim Mitchell was interviewed. He says, "It sounds to me like we've had a few hundred deer killed so far in late August and September", indicating he had received reports of deer deaths from the IND/ILL state line to as far East as Owen, Putnam and Greene counties. Similar outbreaks were recorded in nearly the same locations in 1996 and 2004. "It will affect some individual hunters, in that some localized herds will see a noticeable decrease in population". Reports may be made to the DNR Div. of Fish and Wildlife office in Bloomington @ 812-334-1137 or by contacting the local Conservation Officer through the Owen County Sheriff's Dept. @ 812-829-4874.

[mullis56]

The buck my buddy shot, in Hamilton County was swollen just above a rear hoof nearly 3-4 times larger then his knee joint! Could/would that be a sign? Would it have to be on all hooves or just 1? It was laying close to a lake when he shot it and it had a terrible odor.....

[mbogo]

mullis56 said:

The buck my buddy shot, in Hamilton County was swollen just above a rear hoof nearly 3-4 times larger then his knee joint! Could/would that be a sign? Would it have to be on all hooves or just 1? It was laying close to a lake when he shot it and it had a terrible odor.....

The buck could have been suffering from EHD, but it is imposible to say for certain without having it verified by a professional.

The 3-4 deer I recall seeing back in '96 after the EHD outbreak varied in the number of swollen joints they had.

[turkeyscout]

mbogo said:

hunter480 said:

Woody-Who could we contact at the DNR to ask about some sort of statement-I`m sure others have questions like I do-such as, is this EHD? Does the DNR have any idea how badly this may have hit the herd? Are we likely to continue to find affected deer while bow hunting? Gun Hunting? What do we do if we believe we kill a sick deer? Are there obvious signs for an animal that may not be so far advanced that it displays the bleeding from the nose/mouth, weak, disoriented?

Others probably have questions I haven`t thought of yet, but it would be great to have a comprehensive list of Q and A.

Until an official response is forthcoming here is what I remember of the official statements from last time:

Finding dead deer near water is a classic indicator of EHD as well as the other symptoms mentioned.

Deer will continue dieing until a hard frost kills the flys that transmit the disease.

Swollen joints in the leg just above the hooves can be a sign that the animal has EHD or has survived it.

Animals with EHD are safe for human consumption.

How badly this will hit the herd depends on the timing of the first hard frost and how widespread the outbreaks are.

hey guys. this ehd disease is not good news, i"m a common sense kind of guy: my question is how could a animal with a high fever, swollen joints, near death be safe for human consumption? or should we stay home til that hard frost hits?. we needs some more responce from health dept. i like to have more facts on the seriousness of this outbreak. turkey scout

[mbogo]

It is very difficult for viruses such as this one to cross the species barrier. Thousands of people have knowingly and unknowingly eaten deer infected by EHD with no reported problems.

Not to scare you, but simply staying home until after the first frost wouldn't do you much good, not all infected deer die from the disease so any deer you kill could have still been infected.

[turkeyscout]

hey mbogo, thanks for the info, i feel a little better now. turkey scout

[mbogo]

Not a problem turkey scout, I had similar questions the last time around when I first heard about EHD.

[jkd]

mullis56 said:

The buck my buddy shot, in Hamilton County was swollen just above a rear hoof nearly 3-4 times larger then his knee joint! Could/would that be a sign? Would it have to be on all hooves or just 1? It was laying close to a lake when he shot it and it had a terrible odor.....

Where in Hamilton County did he take this buck? Geist, Morse, or are we talking a private pond?

I hunt northern Hamilton County, so curious where, and if we need to be looking up here for dead deer too...


BTW - when your buddy shot this deer, was it laying down/bedded, moving it's head? And if so, did it react to the shot? Where I'm going here is was the deer already dead when he shot it, hence the "terrible odor"...

On the meat consumption issue, although the EHD virus isn't transmissible to humans, apparently secondary infections that result can cause the meat to be unpalatible...

www.unbc.ca/nlui/wildlife_diseases_bc/EHD.htm

[mullis56]

A retention pond close to 146th and Hazel Dell.

Thanks!

[turkeyscout]

hey guys i talked to a d.n.r. biologist friday, i might add if you do find a dead deer in the water try to take it out, it will pollute the water especially if the the farmers" cows and other wild life use this water. turkey scout