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Post by cambygsp on Jul 17, 2009 7:14:47 GMT -5
There was quite a discussion the other night at the advisory council meeting regarding spotlighting. One fella addressed the council and let them know how much he hated other folks shining his deer. He thought the light beam somehow harassed the deer herd.
First of all, I have been deer hunting for well over 20 years and never has my deer hunting involved a spotlight. I thought the advisory council was addressing hunting related items, spotlighting is not part of hunting. I do agree that alot of folks who deer hunt also spotlight but my opinion is those are two seperate activities. Alot of folks who deer hunt also golf, but those are not related either.
First off my question would be WHY is this subject on the advisory council agenda, untill they allow you to deer hunt with a spotlight it is not part of hunting.
Second, I agree with what another fella at the meeting said.....it would be an enforcement nightmare. Every pizza delivery guy and newspaper deliver service guy in the state would end up being arrested.
Is it illegal to look on to anothers property during daylight hours.........why should it be illegal to look at night? What is going on that folks don't want other folks to see?
IF in the states infinate wisdom they ever do OUTLAW spotlighting.....will they still be allowed to sell spotlights in our stores?.....Maybe I need to notify Q-Beam.
Would we have to quit useing trail cameras that have flashes.....after all wouldnt the flash (light beam) also harass the deer herd?
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Post by freedomhunter on Jul 17, 2009 7:30:31 GMT -5
I think enforcement would be easier if all spotlighting was banned. More poachers would be caught. The rule in Kentucky states if you have livestock you can legally check them with a light, otherwise you can't do it. I understand the traditions and fun, but it is not hunting and it disturbs land owners which is a violation of rights.
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Post by hornharvester on Jul 17, 2009 7:46:05 GMT -5
Good question Camby. While I don't spotlight I really see no reason others cant. I feel that some don't want spot lighters seeing their big bucks and maybe keying in on them during hunting season.
Say the IDNR bans spotlighting, would a person be in violation every time a deer gets into their headlight beams? h.h.
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Post by Woody Williams on Jul 17, 2009 8:22:51 GMT -5
I don't do it anymore , but when I did it was a lot offun.
Pack some soft drinks and snacks and make a family evening of it.
Great way to get kids interested.
I think there can be some common ground here,.
Limit shining to certain times of the year and certain hours within that time frame.
In Pennsylvania it is a real family event. The fields come alive at night with countless cars and trucks driving around shining.
The deer will sometimes lift their heds and look when shined, but most didn't. That leads me to believe that there is next to none poaching going on with lights. Not sure how anyone could poach with all those families out there "seeing the deer".
They had rule then that it was no shining after 11 PM. If anyone shined after that, even if there was no gun in the vehicle, they were in violation....
Compromise on this one...
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Post by raporter on Jul 17, 2009 8:30:30 GMT -5
Spot lighting can be lots of fun. But just like fishing, golfing or any other activity there are some who just don't have manners. It really doesn't take a genious to know you do not shine near a persons house or buildings and if you see the field is full of livestock turn the light off. It really is a popular family activity in many parts of the state.
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Post by jrbhunter on Jul 17, 2009 9:35:40 GMT -5
The rule in Kentucky states if you have livestock you can legally check them with a light, otherwise you can't do it. I understand the traditions and fun, but it is not hunting and it disturbs land owners which is a violation of rights. I believe Kentucky lost their night hunting for predators (a 2nd time) with this latest lighting rule. The removal of spotlighting has ramifications across several sports, albeit sports that many "tunnel vision deer hunters" don't participate in or care about. From checking traps to tying trotlines to calling coyotes to shining coon... there are a lot of innocent sportsmen out there that could get hosed with this latest half-baked idea. It's funny how folks think MORE LAWS will make "ENFORCEMENT" easier. Foolishness. Enforce the one's we have. I've had this discussion with a few CO's. For them, following a 3 million candlepower light in the night sky is very easy... and they can usually tell who's guilty simply by watching them run the light. "People with lights" aren't poachers... but some poachers will carry a light. They often know the difference: even if you don't. I’ve been watching lights in Southern Indiana for 20 years, I took my wife out just last night and got some great photos of baby fox/coon/deer and a snake. I have been run down by drunk a-hole's thinking I was scouting "Their" deer... I've been pulled over and searched numerous times by CO’s... I've dropped a light on naked teenagers in the middle of a secluded field... I’ve busted thieves, potheads, poachers, trespassers, meth labs and more while out “doing my thing” at night. One of the largest meth-busts in this county came 3 days after I was held at gunpoint for shining a farm I have sole-permission to hunt. I’ve rescued passengers pinned in vehicles, I’ve dialed 911 for unconscious accident victims. I've never seen my night activities become a problem for responsible and realistic citizens. If anything, we should be discussing allowing a concealed weapon while spotlighting.... not outlawing it altogether. I can see how it’d be easy to sit in an urban setting and assume that spotlighting leads to illegal activity or is a nuisance to landowners across the state: but the current laws are working. The biggest change in the last 10 years is the “value” placed on trophy bucks in the minds of some elitists’ and I think that’s all this proposal boils down too. |
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Post by cambygsp on Jul 17, 2009 9:54:55 GMT -5
I can see how it’d be easy to sit in an urban setting and assume that spotlighting leads to illegal activity or is a nuisance to landowners across the state: but the current laws are working. The biggest change in the last 10 years is the “value” placed on trophy bucks in the minds of some elitists’ and I think that’s all this proposal boils down too. Actually a DNR Law Enforcement officer at the meeting stated that of the complaint calls they get on spotlighting is bacause that the person doing the complianing "THOUGHT" the activity of spotlighting was already illegal. In other words the chief complaint is spotlighting not what a person is doing while spotlighting. It's funny, but in just about everything in life humans always assume the worst like "oh they are spotlighting, they must be doing something illegal". Still, spotlighting IS NOT DEER HUNTING......the DNR really has no business addressing the matter. |
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Post by kevin1 on Jul 17, 2009 10:38:07 GMT -5
The simple answer would be to permit spotlighting earlier in the year, but disallow it between October1 to December 31.
Speaking as a land owner, I would be annoyed if someone were shining a bright light on my property without seeking permission, just as I was dismayed when my neighbor told me two weeks after the fact that some morel hunter had parked his truck on my land and went into my woods as though he owned the place. Who's to say he wasn't actually there to rob my home? While spotlighting deer may be legal you have no right to do it on someone else's land without their permission.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2009 11:57:09 GMT -5
The best answer would be to do away with it. It has to be a drain on the LE resource to constantly hunt down those spotlighting and see if they are out for pleasure or out for venison?  They won't know until they stop and check out each vehicle or hear gunshots, which is then too late. Camby says spotlighting is not deer hunting, which is true, but it's normally done by deer hunters and normally done to see where the deer are and how many. My guess is that it has lead to a bunch of illegal activity either during the event or afterward. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 17, 2009 12:00:10 GMT -5
[] I believe Kentucky lost their night hunting for predators (a 2nd time) with this latest lighting rule. Not really, you can't spotlight game in Ky., been that away for a long time. You can't hunt ANYTHING at night, with or without a light except for coons and possums. The law deals with a time in realtionship to sunset rather than a light. |
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Post by LawrenceCoBowhunter on Jul 17, 2009 14:20:31 GMT -5
I really don't see any problem with it as long as you don't shine houses or livestock...I do 95% of mine on farms I hunt where there is neither,just bean an clover fields...I'm sure if a poacher wanted to shoot a deer they could do it fairly easy with a truck/car headlight.What's going to be next a ban on night vision gear?
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Post by fowlhunter on Jul 17, 2009 15:03:48 GMT -5
Camby posted
"Still, spotlighting IS NOT DEER HUNTING......the DNR really has no business addressing the matter."
You could not be more wrong Camby. The use of an artificial light while possessing a firearm or bow is in title 14 of the Indiana Code. Title 14 is the Fish and Wildlife section of the Indiana Code. So who do you suggest to address this issue?
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Post by gundude on Jul 17, 2009 15:44:20 GMT -5
JRB,,,, your my hero. Sounds like you have done a lot of crime fighting while out with your trusty light... Do wear a cape? ;>)
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Post by jkd on Jul 17, 2009 16:24:56 GMT -5
About 3 or so seasons back, opening morning of gun season, I was in a ground brush blind on the edge of a woods bordering a 17 acre alfalfa field, and the east edge of that field borders a county road. I was 250 yds west of the road. I was in position 30 minutes before legal shooting time, or 1 hour before sunrise... deer routinely fed in the hayfield during the night before moving to water at an open ditch in the woods.
As I was getting some calls and such out of my backpack, a truck came down the road slowly and fired up a spotlight, and as he came down the road, he lit up my position. My immediate thought was "I hope this dumb*** doesn't shoot me..." I grabbed a small maglight from my pack and flashed it at him, and he hit the gas...
Kevin1 is exactly right, IMO... once any firearms season is open, spotlighting should be banned... those who think there's no harm no foul may rethink that concept once you've been lit up...
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Post by duff on Jul 17, 2009 16:39:39 GMT -5
I agree with Camby. It is not deer hunting or any other activity that DNR has control over unless you are poaching. Flashlight is not required to be a poacher and will not make finding and convicting poachers any easier. It will most likely take away from that as the CO will be chasing people shining as they always have with no weapons in hand. We do not need regulators telling us where we can and can not point a flashlight sorry folks. Our state really does have more important crap to regulate then that!!!
These proposals for new laws really bites my butt. Is it really an issue that our DNR needs to address? Why are advisory council even taking time on this? Look at it from the outside in, a state regulator is going to tell you where and when you can use a flashlight..... Bwahahahahaha Sounds like a liberal's approach to me. More regulations please, someone might know I have a big buck in my back yard!
Please, if that is what we have to worry about then we are doing pretty good IMO....
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Post by whitetaildave24 on Jul 17, 2009 20:06:23 GMT -5
I don't see anything wrong with it. My family loves to take night cruises to see what is out in the fields. Keep it the way it is.
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Post by cambygsp on Jul 18, 2009 4:05:04 GMT -5
Camby posted "Still, spotlighting IS NOT DEER HUNTING......the DNR really has no business addressing the matter." You could not be more wrong Camby. The use of an artificial light while possessing a firearm or bow is in title 14 of the Indiana Code. Title 14 is the Fish and Wildlife section of the Indiana Code. So who do you suggest to address this issue? Spotlighting while possessing ANY TYPE of a firearm is considered poaching NOT HUNTING......It's just like drinking alcohol, it's not illegal untill you get behind the wheel of a vehicle and do it. I think this matter may belong with the state legislature IF it needs to be addressed, NOT the Natural Resource Advisory Council. I personally don't think we need a law that says where a person can LOOK day or night. If you don't want a person looking onto your property, put up a privacy fence! |
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Post by jackc99 on Jul 18, 2009 8:19:16 GMT -5
Page 7 of the Indiana Hunting Guide: " SpotlightingIt is illegal to shine a spotlight, searchlight or other artificial light for the purpose of taking, attempting to take or assisting another person to take a deer, or to shine such a light while in possession of a firearm, bow or crossbow. It also is illegal for a person to deliberately cast a spotlight or other artificial light from a motor vehicle if in possession of a loaded firearm, bow and arrow or crossbow." www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/files/fw-hg_generalinfo.pdfJack |
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Post by indychris on Jul 18, 2009 15:55:55 GMT -5
Woody-
I couldn't agree more with the idea of spotlighting being a Pennsylvania family tradition. We're out in South Central PA every Thanksgiving and after dinner every year Several of us head out together in a quad cab with a couple of spotlights. It's fun just because we get to see what's looming in the fields together. For most of us, it's the only time we get to do anything 'deer' related together.
I's sure miss it if they outlawed it.
As for law enforcement...there are very few poachers who do what they do in complete secrecy. If hunters would simply buck it up and start taking responsibility for the illegal activity they know about, poaching would be reduced in a heartbeat, IMO.
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Post by jackc99 on Jul 18, 2009 17:35:55 GMT -5
As mentioned previously this is the Indiana Code reference found in Title 14 Natural Resources under Article 22 Fish & Wildlife.
IC 14-22-6-7
Jacklighting prohibited
Sec. 7. (a) This section does not apply to an employee of the department or an employee of a federal wildlife management agency who:
(1) is acting in the performance of the employee's duties; and
(2) has received the express written consent of the director for the employee's action.
(b) A person may not knowingly throw or cast the rays of any spotlight or other artificial light:
(1) not required by law on a motor vehicle; and
(2) in search of or upon any wild bird or wild animal;
from a vehicle while the person possesses a firearm, bow, or crossbow, if by throwing or casting the rays a wild bird or wild animal could be killed. This subsection applies even though the animal is not killed, injured, shot at, or otherwise pursued.
(c) A person may not take any wildlife, except furbearing mammals, with the aid of illumination of any spotlight, searchlight, or other artificial light.
(d) A person may not shine a spotlight, searchlight, or other artificial light for the purpose of taking, attempting to take, or assisting another person to take a deer.
As added by P.L.1-1995, SEC.15. Amended by P.L.13-2007, SEC.1.
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They won't know until they stop and check out each vehicle or hear gunshots, which is then too late.
