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Post by tenring on Jan 11, 2014 6:29:57 GMT -5
I started a salt lick a number of years ago on a cousins' farm [with the CO's permission ahead of time] and even have a sign posted about no hunting within a certain radius. What deer that are left after EHD tear it up big time, looks like a back hoe has been there. Add 50 lbs. of mineral salt [salt and pepper] in the spring, and 50 lbs. of mixing salt in the summer. Squirrels and rabbits love it also.
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Post by duff on Jan 11, 2014 6:46:21 GMT -5
I don't remember, was the baiting suggestion deer specific? I ask, because like legal firearms, we have multiple rules that are situational. Yes deer specific, and the question was worded to make the responder consider how the wording is subjective. What about bird feeders? I know some people that spend lots of $ feeding birds. A co could take current rule and make a case that the deer are influenced by a large bird feeder spot, specifically urban zones. I would be all for rewording of the rule to make it less subjective
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Post by subzero350 on Jan 11, 2014 12:58:29 GMT -5
We have a Savage-Stevens .410 bolt action smoothbore shotgun (w/ 3 round detachable clip) my wife uses for Deer hunting. The clip is set up for 3" magnum shells only and will not feed 2 1/2" shells correctly (although the gun will fire them just fine).
Brenneke makes a 3" magnum rifled (1/4 ounce) slug that works exceptionally well in this gun. This gun with the Brenneke slug keyholes the target at 50 yards every time. Beyond 50 yards, it isn't so accurate (although I have to ask - what smoothbore shotgun is?). Brenneke advertises that this 1/4 ounce projectile leaves the barrel at 1755 feet per sec with an energy of 781 ft/lbs.
In contrast, Cor-Bon makes a .357 magnum deer hunting cartridge that has a muzzle velocity of 1200 feet per second and muzzle energy of 576 ft/lbs. That's less velocity and energy leaving the barrel than what the Brenneke .410 slug boasts (although the .357 bullet is heavier).
The point I'm trying to make is the .410 slug has enough energy to kill a deer when used properly. Same as the .357 magnum. You aren't going to shoot a deer at 300 yards with a .357 magnum, nor should you try doing it with a .410 load.
Furthermore, the .410 slug has more energy than any arrow or crossbow bolt you are ever going to use for deer hunting. So if the argument is going to be made to ban the .410 round for deer hunting because it is "underpowered", then what does that say about archery equipment? I have not seen a bow or crossbow produce projectile energy numbers anywhere close to what even a .410 slug produces.
If the concern here is about wounding and not killing the animal, I am willing to bet there are a lot more deer that are wounded by inexperienced archers (and not killed) than those shot by even .410 rounds. So I have to ask, why is there so much hate for the .410 slug? It has its place along with a host of other weapons for deer hunting. As long as it isn't used outside of its practical capabilities, it does its job just fine.
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Post by shouldernuke on Jan 17, 2014 16:49:04 GMT -5
Well just an update on this .Chad Stewart left me a message on the cell phone today as I left my name and number about wanting to talk about the deer herd reduction and some issues in the counties where I hunt and the new reg proposals .I left him the message a few days ago and we will be talking on Tuesday about these issues and the deer herd decline .EHD , Liberal tags ,and coyotes will all be brought to the table and the fact that the late antlerless season has real issues now that the herd has nose dived in so many areas of our state.
I will be sure to post here and on my site what transpires and if any resolve is in the offing for the hunters and deer herd of my area and others in the state that is suffering what is likely 20 -25 year lows .
On a quick side note there was talk on another forum and mentioned here that there needs to be some sort of hunter / user registration so people can not leave lop sided input or flood it with input. Some said use a drivers lic number or have a number generated or use an IP address when leaving input or remarks on the DNR sites. The truth is every deer hunter in this state has a issued hunter number that is their lifetime number .You use it when buying a lic. on line its on your tag /lic it is also issued when a hunter checks in an animal on the online check system .That one number can be used as a verification and can not allow any duplication of input results.
Nuke
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Post by duff on Jan 17, 2014 18:08:11 GMT -5
Cheaters cheat regardless of the methods put out there to prevent it. Not sure it would be much value added, as it would restrict more honest feedback as opposed to prevent abuse. May be the objective though?
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Post by cedarthicket on Jan 17, 2014 18:13:23 GMT -5
Well just an update on this .Chad Stewart left me a message on the cell phone today as I left my name and number about wanting to talk about the deer herd reduction and some issues in the counties where I hunt and the new reg proposals .I left him the message a few days ago and we will be talking on Tuesday about these issues and the deer herd decline .EHD , Liberal tags ,and coyotes will all be brought to the table and the fact that the late antlerless season has real issues now that the herd has nose dived in so many areas of our state. I will be sure to post here and on my site what transpires and if any resolve is in the offing for the hunters and deer herd of my area and others in the state that is suffering what is likely 20 -25 year lows . Nuke Looking forward to the post of your talk with Chad Stewart. Out of curiosity, what is your site on which you will also post info regarding your talk?
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Post by throbak on Feb 23, 2014 13:27:28 GMT -5
PLEASE support the proposed regulations on CATFISH its a Step in the right direction . Do I think its enough NO but a Giant step from what we now have which is NOTHING so with that said, please support these new catfish regulations BTW Ohio is going to start Tagging large Flats and Blues to study their movements on the Ohio River they will have a red Tag and 100 of those will have ping transmitters implanted in them
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Post by steve46511 on Feb 24, 2014 16:46:12 GMT -5
Feedback in that link (thanks for that) is only till Feb 28, gang, for anyone not yet doing so. Four days and counting.
God Bless
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Post by Russ Koon on Feb 26, 2014 12:02:17 GMT -5
Finally remembered to get my two cents worth in yesterday. Thanks for the reminders.
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 13, 2014 10:28:24 GMT -5
I got the file from the DNR.
Looks to be a record amount of input given. Good going guys and gals!
Due to the amount they hope to have at least one proposal for the June NRC Advisory Committee to look at.
Deer input alone was 1,211 pieces of input. They were:
General Deer(includes baiting) - 444
Deer Firearms (lots of wanting all center fires) - 479
Deer (28 gauge) - 110
Deer UDZ - 114
Deer youth - 64
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Post by subzero350 on Mar 21, 2014 13:50:47 GMT -5
I got the file from the DNR. Looks to be a record amount of input given. Good going guys and gals! Due to the amount they hope to have at least one proposal for the June NRC Advisory Committee to look at. Deer input alone was 1,211 pieces of input. They were: General Deer(includes baiting) - 444
Deer Firearms (lots of wanting all center fires) - 479
Deer (28 gauge) - 110
Deer UDZ - 114
Deer youth - 64I read some of the comments from the link the DNR provided me with in an email that some people submitted for consideration and some of them are just downright comical (partial list below): MY FAVORITE (most of which I agree with): The problem is people look at the deer population based on what they see in their areas and don't consider what is going on in other areas of the state. For example, I've read a lot of posts on this forum from members who say they haven't seen near as much deer this last season (most of those people live in the mid or southern section of the state, I think). In my case, I've seen more deer and continue to see the herds grow in the areas I frequent. IT ALL HAS TO DO WITH HABITAT PEOPLE. If the local environment can support a herd, a herd will be present and flourish. If your local habitat can't support it (ie: no cover, no food, & no water - you need ALL three), you aren't going to see big deer populations. A great example of this are some of the counties just south of where I live (Allen Co.). If you go south, it is mostly flat farmland - very little woods / mostly clear-cut fields. There is plenty of food, but no cover and little water supply. This equals low deer populations in these areas (I can drive for hours and never see 1 deer). Now if I go north into Noble County where there are a lot of lakes, woods, and some farms (still lots of food), the deer population up there is almost in out-of-control proportions. It isn't uncommon to drive around the lakes and see 2, 3, or 4 dozen deer eating in the fields near dusk on any given day. BOTTOM LINE is the DNR needs to consider herd management on a county by county basis and not dial it back or adjust it for the entire state like it sounds some people want done (based on what was put in the comments). And please, stop the BS with wanting to ban crossbows. Some of us like our shoulders and need them for our livelihood (I know more than a few former bow hunters that can no longer shoot a bow because they have blown their shoulders out from doing it too long).
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Post by hunter7x on Mar 27, 2014 12:56:09 GMT -5
"Furthermore, the .410 slug has more energy than any arrow or crossbow bolt you are ever going to use for deer hunting. So if the argument is going to be made to ban the .410 round for deer hunting because it is "underpowered", then what does that say about archery equipment? I have not seen a bow or crossbow produce projectile energy numbers anywhere close to what even a .410 slug produces."
bows and xguns kill by hemorrhage not shock. The broadhead blades are the killer not the arrow.
apples to oranges comparison.
a .22 will kill deer if put in the right spot as will a field point. That doesn't mean it is an efficient way of doing it.
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Post by shouldernuke on Mar 27, 2014 18:19:16 GMT -5
Furthermore its quite obvious that some here have no clue as to what kills animals by what type weapon is being used .
A bow does not kill with kinetic energy at all I is a hemorrhage weapon only and requires very little energy to cause the tissues to be cut and thus bleed out an animal .On the other hand guns kill by kinetic energy and the massive tissue damage done by the transfer of that energy to the internal organs not by hemorrhage . bleed out by gun shot is just a symptom of the real killer and that is massive tissue damage .
A 410 is a poor excuse for a big game gun period and to argue that if a gun as poor as the 410 or 28 ga is to be banned then a cutting weapon such as a bow or xbow that uses hemorrhage only to kill shows little knowledge of what actually kills the animals and the weapons being used .
Facts are facts here and yes anything that punctures the thoracic cavity will over time cause hypovolemic shock and kill the game but there has to be lower limits set and the puny 200 - 400 ftp of energy that these guns produce is a poor representative for the job .But then again why would anyone want to wait up to 24 hrs to recover a deer that has just a hole in the ribcage .
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Post by Woody Williams on Mar 27, 2014 21:12:24 GMT -5
A properly placed arrow (double lung)causes death by hemorrhage and collapse of the lungs with fatal asphyxia.
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Post by ms660 on Mar 31, 2014 16:40:24 GMT -5
"Furthermore, the .410 slug has more energy than any arrow or crossbow bolt you are ever going to use for deer hunting. So if the argument is going to be made to ban the .410 round for deer hunting because it is "underpowered", then what does that say about archery equipment? I have not seen a bow or crossbow produce projectile energy numbers anywhere close to what even a .410 slug produces." bows and xguns kill by hemorrhage not shock. The broadhead blades are the killer not the arrow. apples to oranges comparison. a .22 will kill deer if put in the right spot as will a field point. That doesn't mean it is an efficient way of doing it. I agree. Try shoving a 410 slug through a deer by hand then try an arrow tipped with a razor sharp broadhead. By the way I have nothing against using a 410 for deer hunting if the person knows his-hers limits
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