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Post by swilk on Sept 3, 2014 8:08:19 GMT -5
Never have understood why these opinion scenarios always turn to a "my opinion is better than yours" type of situation ......
Some guys want certain things and some guys dont. Everyone has their limits ..... and there isnt anything wrong with that.
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Post by jjas on Sept 3, 2014 8:44:25 GMT -5
Jack Ryan
Of your entire post, the above sentence is the one I agree most with.....
And while some consider it selfish for others to want to use a rifle or crossbow, I consider it selfish for others to constantly belittle those who don't hunt "their" way. I consider it selfish for one group of hunters to constantly wage war against the other and try to move or shorten the season(s) of those they disagree with, so as to extend "their" own season or "protect the herd" against gun, crossbow and even youth hunters.
If one wants to hunt with bow only and that drives them, I say great, have @ it. If one wants to pursue only trophy class bucks, I say have @ it. But not everyone is going to feel that way and those folks should be able to fill their tag with whatever legal deer (trophy buck or not) that they wish to, while using whatever legal piece of equipment they choose to.
In the end, you are correct that selfishness is going to destroy hunting....but I have to wonder who is really being selfish?
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Post by swilk on Sept 3, 2014 8:49:19 GMT -5
IMO, that whole "their own season" thing would only hold water if only certain folks were allowed to hunt that season. That is not the case .... there is no special seasons for special people. Everyone has the same opportunities to hunt each season.
But we couldnt have the "elitists" and the "slobs" if everyone was honest about things .... could we.
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Post by onebentarrow on Sept 3, 2014 8:50:38 GMT -5
I acculy like the proposal. It gives me more choices. My mz is good to 250 yds. I will still kill my 3 deer ( buck & 2 does) to fill freezer. What does it matter what u kill your deer with. If I remember correct there is a large % of the hunters that kill 2 or less deer each year. Did u spend a lot of money on a wildcat so u would have an advantage on the "shotgun" guys or afraid some one else will kill the deer u been watching.
I guess many I am at that age where I am happy to See anyone get a deer, buck or doe, big or small, young kid or old man
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Post by Woody Williams on Sept 3, 2014 8:50:39 GMT -5
I wonder how many of these bow-only hunters are also the same ones that want to ban crossbows? And of those, I wonder how many would vehemently oppose a ban on compound bows - forcing them to only use long bows or recurves? Selfishness is going to bring about the downfall of hunting as a sport. Just give it time. NOBODY wanted to BAN crossbows. Crossbows were not a legal weapon to hunt deer in Indiana for decades and decades, since the inception of deer hunting regulations in fact. No one needed to ban them, they were never legal for regular hunters other than those with handicap permits. Now any one can use the same weapons only the handicapped could use before. Apparently it's still not enough for this generation of lame wannabees to kill a deer. They are in for a surprise though. It may seem like a good idea now but by the year after they still won't be able to kill anything they can't kill now. What will be left for them to cry and whine over then? Oh, I guess they could want to carry a bucket of corn out there. You are exactly on the money about selfishness destroying the sport. It's come a long way toward and I pretty much expect the resource to be destroyed and unhuntable with in 5 years. We are several years in to programs for slob hunters to have an excuse for killing deer they don't even want. Most of them pretty much kill twice as many or more than they tag and shoot ten times as many bullets in the field than deer they tag. At least, and that's with their "more accurate" weapons. Just you average run of the mill hunter today is about the most offensive slob hunter imaginable by standards of just 20 years ago. LOL...Good 'ol Jack... It was in 1986 that the DNR allowed permanently physically challenged in Indiana to be allowed the use of a crossbow in the archery season. I believe it was in 1996 or so when they allowed crossbows to be used by anyone in the late season - antlerless only. They needed to protect those bucks for the "real bow hunters". It wasn't until 2002 that crossbowers could take a buck in the late season - on a 5 year trial basis...that was extended another 5 years. The "organized hunting groups" fought crossbows in the late season no matter what we could hunt. In 2012 we finally got to choose another piece of archery equipment to use in archery season... just like we did back when compounds came on the scene. Jack and others, Crossbowers are no different than any other hunters in wanting a piece of the pie. Vertical archery hunters have done the same thing over the years by requesting more and more lengthly seasons. What was once a season of less than a month is now more than 90 days of hunting and they don't like to share that time period. Yes, the wanted to "ban" any inclusion of crossbows whatsoever ..except the physically challenged and some of them did not like even that. It was OK that they could request more and more but those dang crossbowers should not be able to.. Hypocritical? You bet..
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Post by swilk on Sept 3, 2014 8:55:04 GMT -5
Crossbows are their own equipment category ... with their own license.
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Post by Woody Williams on Sept 3, 2014 8:56:47 GMT -5
Crossbows are their own equipment category ... with their own license. Sure they are..
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Post by swilk on Sept 3, 2014 8:58:18 GMT -5
Do they have their own license?
I understand the spin folks try and put on it.... that they are really just archery equipment and nothing more but if that were the case I cant see the DNR giving them their own license.
I am just stating a truth that crossbows have a license of their own.
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Post by throbak on Sept 3, 2014 9:06:17 GMT -5
I am Bow and MZL and I am against it so not all fit that description But I can tell you this any one living in or near a Amish community better be prepared for a HUGE Deer reduction if Passed you can take that to the bank guys I sometimes hunt in Noble county and there are already a ton of Amish who currently hunt with guns (don't know about bows because I haven't bow hunted in Noble Co. yet). So I don't see how allowing the use of more centerfire rifles is going to change that or make the deer population plummet overnight. Like firstwd said, I think the legalization of new rifle cartridges isn't going to bring a host of new hunters into the fold but rather it will just have the effect of changing the type of equipment the current hunters use. You will see
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Post by cougars48 on Sept 3, 2014 9:14:42 GMT -5
I personally am in a love hate relationship with HPR being allowed. On one hand id love to use them on the ground i hunt but on the other I live in a small private land pocket surrounded by a F & W property on both sides. Im worried every year with the amount of hunters that pack into a square mile on opening wknd and with HPR's id be real worried. Sure there are guns legal now that are comparabelto HPR's but like has been mentioned already they are not readily available for anybody with $250 walking into a pawn shop. Maybe put F&W propertys all on draws for firearms season so they are not so crowded?
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Post by bigbuckd on Sept 3, 2014 9:27:19 GMT -5
The DNR is focused on regulating the Indiana deer herd to their ideal. New weapons will allow greater opportunity and a lower entry point for hunters to help with the DNR's goals.
What the DNR wants and what hunters want do not always line up.
With the new weapons I would expect to potentially see the gun season shortened due to the increased range of opportunity with the new weapons and an increase in safety regulations due to the same increase in range.
It does not matter what weapon is used to kill a deer but the manner in which the weapon is used to kill the deer. Indiana will see new weapons and new regulations put in place in the near future. We as Indiana hunters must help in what those regulations may mean to hunters.
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Post by span870 on Sept 3, 2014 9:32:30 GMT -5
I've lived around Amish all my life. From schuylkill county in Pennsylvania with argueably to highest concentration of Amish anywhere in the U.S. to where I live now in Lawrence county. They don't kill anymore deer than the DNR allows them to. They are not slob hunters and they don't willy nilly just throw lead anymore than the average English hunter. What they do is kill deer that feed there family throughout the year. Unlike shot of English hunters who shot a deer don't want it and give it away for "charity". I feed my beagles all running season on meat from hunters freezers that went to waste. If you have a problem with the Amish killing too many deer talk to the DNR. They aren't breaking any rules that the DNR has set for legal chase. Do they drive hunt. Yep. Is it legal. Yep. Or is it the fact that most are a brown and down and not trophy hunters? Is sorry for the rant but I get sick of hearing the bashing of the Amish every year on this subject when they are some of the nicest most giving people I have ever had the priveledge of knowing. Maybe if us " English" would adobt some of there ideas and living our world wouldn't be in the state it is. I say until you take a long bow with no sight and arrows you made with flint tips and stalked deer on the ground and killed it don't complain to anyone about the purity of your weapon or the ease of someone elses
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Post by hornzilla on Sept 3, 2014 9:45:56 GMT -5
I've lived around Amish all my life. From schuylkill county in Pennsylvania with argueably to highest concentration of Amish anywhere in the U.S. to where I live now in Lawrence county. They don't kill anymore deer than the DNR allows them to. They are not slob hunters and they don't willy nilly just throw lead anymore than the average English hunter. What they do is kill deer that feed there family throughout the year. Unlike shot of English hunters who shot a deer don't want it and give it away for "charity". I feed my beagles all running season on meat from hunters freezers that went to waste. If you have a problem with the Amish killing too many deer talk to the DNR. They aren't breaking any rules that the DNR has set for legal chase. Do they drive hunt. Yep. Is it legal. Yep. Or is it the fact that most are a brown and down and not trophy hunters? Is sorry for the rant but I get sick of hearing the bashing of the Amish every year on this subject when they are some of the nicest most giving people I have ever had the priveledge of knowing. Maybe if us " English" would adobt some of there ideas and living our world wouldn't be in the state it is. I say until you take a long bow with no sight and arrows you made with flint tips and stalked deer on the ground and killed it don't complain to anyone about the purity of your weapon or the ease of someone elses Every good post. I agree one hundred percent.
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Post by jjas on Sept 3, 2014 9:50:14 GMT -5
IMO, that whole "their own season" thing would only hold water if only certain folks were allowed to hunt that season. That is not the case .... there is no special seasons for special people. Everyone has the same opportunities to hunt each season. But we couldnt have the "elitists" and the "slobs" if everyone was honest about things .... could we. By "their" I mean the season of "their" choice. For example...Many bowhunters didn't want to share "their" archery season with additional equipment choices (crossbows), but many of these same people are pushing for firearms seasons to be moved/shortened. And as far as being honest goes...99% of the disagreements on these forums wouldn't happen if people weren't so eaten up with trophy bucks.
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Post by swilk on Sept 3, 2014 9:57:40 GMT -5
And 99% of arguments over sports could be avoided if scores weren't kept and records weren't recorded.
Competition is a fact of life in most areas. Like it or not......
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Post by deerpreacher on Sept 3, 2014 10:43:30 GMT -5
To think that allowing HPRs is going to have a drastic effect on deer populations is going overboard. Deer Quotas are the main culprit. Hunters must learn to regulate themselves to keep our sport. I personally am looking forward to using my 7mm mag.
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Post by varmint101 on Sept 3, 2014 11:00:12 GMT -5
Should just use a 410. Same as a high powered rifle I hear. ;-)
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Post by trapperdave on Sept 3, 2014 11:26:09 GMT -5
if you research the facts, hpr are safer than slugs from a 12 ga.
the kill will not increase, just the different means by which to harvest a deer. Nobody will kill any MORE deer than they already do.
That same wore out argument was used against compounds, then inlines, then pistol rounds in lever guns, then crossbows.....
If YOU personally want a greater deer hunting challenge then i invite you to pick up a recurve, longbow, selfbow, flintlock, caplock....whatever trips YOUR trigger. AND QUIT WORRYING ABOUT WHAT YOUR NEIGHBOR HUNTS WITH OR WHAT HE/SHE DECIDES TO HARVEST.
MY .02
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Post by jjas on Sept 3, 2014 11:39:07 GMT -5
And 99% of arguments over sports could be avoided if scores weren't kept and records weren't recorded. Competition is a fact of life in most areas. Like it or not...... Not a thing wrong with competition. It's how you handle winning/losing that people seem to have problems with. And besides...I've never looked @ deer hunting as a competitive sport anyway. Perhaps therein lies the difference. Have a good day....
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Post by jjas on Sept 3, 2014 11:40:31 GMT -5
if you research the facts, hpr are safer than slugs from a 12 ga. the kill will not increase, just the different means by which to harvest a deer. Nobody will kill any MORE deer than they already do. That same wore out argument was used against compounds, then inlines, then pistol rounds in lever guns, then crossbows..... If YOU personally want a greater deer hunting challenge then i invite you to pick up a recurve, longbow, selfbow, flintlock, caplock....whatever trips YOUR trigger. AND QUIT WORRYING ABOUT WHAT YOUR NEIGHBOR HUNTS WITH OR WHAT HE/SHE DECIDES TO HARVEST. MY .02
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