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Post by cambygsp on Aug 2, 2005 17:45:26 GMT -5
The fact is, many of these farmers don't even do the shooting.....they recruit brother-in-laws, nephews and such to actually pull the trigger
It's a bad deal for the sportsfolks in this state....PERIOD!!!
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 2, 2005 19:46:52 GMT -5
The fact is, many of these farmers don't even do the shooting.....they recruit brother-in-laws, nephews and such to actually pull the trigger It's a bad deal for the sportsfolks in this state....PERIOD!!! True enough , Camby . What's your solution and how could it be achieved ? Longer hunting season ? Brief hunting periods year round for spot control ? Bounties for certain counties perhaps ? With 330 deer per year at stake we'd better act fast !
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 5:45:20 GMT -5
""With 330 deer per year at stake we'd better act fast !""
My beleif is the number is ALOT higher than that. Just take a look at the story, ONE FARMER KILLED 60 in one summer! Thats 20%...so I aint buying the 330 number.
I would be willing to bet that the 330 number is "how many" farmers partisapate....not how many deer get killed.
Tell me this......why not issue the permits during the actual hunting season? Why not allow firearm hunting on these farms during the entire deer season? Why do they need to kill them "out-of-season"? If you significantly reduce the deer population on the farm during October, November and December....won't there be far fewer deer to do damage to the crops come June & July?
You know, there was atime that biologists issued depradation permits for use during the deer season. It was about 15 or so years ago....I know this because I hunted a farm back then that qualified and received these permits. He would give us a certificate and we would have to take that certificate and present it at a license outlet and purchase a "depradation license"....it was good for "antlerless only". That was back when EVERYONE had to "apply" for antlerless tags. We thought it was slick because we had the "in" and were always able to obtain the antlerless license!
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Post by multidigits on Aug 3, 2005 6:14:48 GMT -5
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 6:39:01 GMT -5
Abstract: Indiana has a tiered approach when dealing with deer damage occurring on commercial or non-commercial property. Of land exhibiting deer damage, most complaints are observed on agricultural properties. A landowner complaint results in an inspection by a biologist who will discuss non-lethal and lethal options. If lethal options are deemed appropriate, Deer Damage Control Permits for out-of-season hunting may be issued. During 2003, 228 damage reports were filed, with soybeans and corn being the most frequently damaged crop. During the 2003 Deer Damage Control Permit program, 302 control permits were issued statewide, resulting in 1,282 deer harvested.
During 2003, 228 deer damage complaints were received by the IDNR. This remains a substantial decrease from the 580 complaints filed in 1995 but a 52 percent increase from the 150 complaints reported in 2002. District biologists felt that the elimination of the Depredation Zones was responsible for the sharp decrease in complaints to IDNR personnel from 1995 to 1996. The steady effort to reduce and stabilize the statewide deer populations since 1996 has resulted in stabilizing the number of deer damage complaints at about 175 complaints per year. Eighty-six percent of the damage complaints received involved properties with a previous history of deer damage. Of these, 68 percent had previously notified and worked with IDNR personnel on the damage problem. Of landowners filing complaints, almost all (approximately 95 percent) allowed some deer hunting on their property.
Soybeans was the principal crop damaged in 36 percent of the complaints, followed by corn (30 percent) . The percentage of crop most commonly lost ranged from 0-5 percent (62 percent of all complaints). Significantly more complaints for deer damage were submitted during the June-July period (61 percent), than during other months.
Investigating biologists evaluated whether a particular cover type and/or adjoining land ownership was associated with the damage area. Deciduous woodland was the most common type of cover associated with damage (84 percent) followed by River/Stream areas (8 percent). Privately-owned parcels adjoining damaged property was implicated as a contributing factor to damage in 52 percent of the cases investigated. Governmental land holdings accounted for 35 percent of parcels adjoining damaged property.
During 2003, 302 permits were issued statewide. Under this program, 2,627 deer were authorized to be taken. This was a 56 percent increase from the 1,685 deer authorized to be harvested in 2002. Of the authorized deer for 2003, 1,282 deer were actually harvested for a success rate of 49 percent. The number of deer harvested in 2003 increased 87 percent from the 687 deer harvested in 2002 under the deer damage permit program. Deer damage reports tend to increase in years that produce decreased crop yields for farmers, and an unusually wet spring in 2003 likely reduced the overall yield.
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 6:40:24 GMT -5
Kevin1, With 1282 deer per year at stake we'd better act fast !
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 3, 2005 8:03:11 GMT -5
Camby , I would guess that they don't issue them during the hunting season to avoid hurting hunting license revenues . It makes sense when you think about it .
Nobody really knows for sure how many deer we have , or how many are shot on farms with or without a permit . My guess is that the number isn't significant or DNR would be investigating the issue more . Poachers probably shoot more deer than farmers , but nobody knows how many there either . Judging by the number of deer that I've personally seen I don't think we're in any danger of running out anytime soon .
Hmmm ... Guns blazing on farms across the state during the bow season ? Aren't farms the primary source of private access ? Somehow I don't think the bow hunters would support that , and since they make up 59% of us according to what JB posted earlier they would probably get it shot down . Besides , the deer you shoot in October will just be replaced by the Spring fawns .
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 8:12:43 GMT -5
Theb deer shot in October will not be bearing any spring fawns!!!!!
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Post by duff on Aug 3, 2005 8:15:21 GMT -5
How many deer are killed during hunting season? 12-1300 deer is still minor in the big picture.
I understand neighbors who hunt for sport would be upset if the guy next door kills 50 or so deer during the summer, but most would be upset if the guy let 10-25 people on his land to hunt during deer season too.
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Post by jackryan on Aug 3, 2005 8:44:07 GMT -5
How many deer are killed during hunting season? 12-1300 deer is still minor in the big picture. . Those are only big numbers when people are using them to prove how effective the OBR was.
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 3, 2005 8:49:21 GMT -5
Theb deer shot in October will not be bearing any spring fawns!!!!! The majority of the herd that didn't get killed will be .
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Post by multidigits on Aug 3, 2005 9:11:36 GMT -5
Camby , I would guess that they don't issue them during the hunting season to avoid hurting hunting license revenues . It makes sense when you think about it . Nobody really knows for sure how many deer we have , or how many are shot on farms with or without a permit . My guess is that the number isn't significant or DNR would be investigating the issue more . Poachers probably shoot more deer than farmers , but nobody knows how many there either . Judging by the number of deer that I've personally seen I don't think we're in any danger of running out anytime soon . Hmmm ... Guns blazing on farms across the state during the bow season ? Aren't farms the primary source of private access ? Somehow I don't think the bow hunters would support that , and since they make up 59% of us according to what JB posted earlier they would probably get it shot down . Besides , the deer you shoot in October will just be replaced by the Spring fawns . The facts are that crop damage permits are a nessasary evil. You won't understand unless your in the shoes of a farmer that has to live off the land. The DNRs across the county understand this as does the legislature that regulate the permits. As for timing of when they get used, they have to be used when the deer are doing the damage. The reason is that they get used then is because the huinting season didn't correct the problem when it could have. There's reasons why, but those aren't the responsibility of the farmer. The farmer has other worries than who uses his permits and when they do it. The number of crop damage permits is always so low that it's not a management factor. In other words, 1200 to 2000 deer statewide isn't a concern for anyone in the DNR in the overall scope of the deer plan.
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Post by kevin1 on Aug 3, 2005 9:42:53 GMT -5
Thanks Multidigits , that's pretty much what I was trying to say .
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 9:48:32 GMT -5
How many deer are killed during hunting season? 12-1300 deer is still minor in the big picture. . Those are only big numbers when people are using them to prove how effective the OBR was. NOW.........THAT is funny!!!!!!!
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 10:09:45 GMT -5
The bottom line here is that I don't support "sharp shooting" deer as a way to controll populations. I don't support it in the state park system, I don't support it "surburban" settings and I don't support it on farms.
It is a PROVEN fact that adequet hunting pressure will controll any overpopulation problem that might exists.
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Post by multidigits on Aug 3, 2005 11:43:11 GMT -5
Nope....there are several states that have super liberal limits on does, and nearly 6 months of deer hunting, yet the herd continues to grow for one reason or the other. You might say that normally, hunting will control the deer population when all other factors pitch in to help out. Take Indiana for example. they have several problems that keep it from working like Camby says it will. Number one is the price of doe tags makes it undesirable to kill large numbers of does. The other is a universal problem faced by many states, and that is the fact that hunters will only kll what their freezers will hold. When they get full, they hunt something else or they quit, even if the price is zero. Not sure about a Hunters for the Hungry program in Indiana, but these work to help, but are not a final solution. Especially if the drop off is not 100% free. Farmers normally don't hire sharpshooters. They shoot what they see eating their groceries. Take a look at Ind. DNR Strategic Deer PLan ( www.in.gov/dnr/fishwild/hunt/deer/deerplan.htm ) and see how many references are made to deer control permits. This is one item that is not going away anytime soon.
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Post by cambygsp on Aug 3, 2005 13:20:04 GMT -5
the herd continues to grow for one reason or the other.....because hunters don't have access
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Post by multidigits on Aug 3, 2005 13:43:33 GMT -5
Private lands....the owners decide who gets access and for what reason. No law or legislature will ever dictate that someone has to allow hunting on their property. Likewise, the deer belong to the state, and the state will remian responsible to control their numbers. If it take deer cotrol permits to do it, it will be done.
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Post by multidigits on Aug 3, 2005 15:57:41 GMT -5
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Post by jackryan on Aug 3, 2005 17:21:16 GMT -5
Hey! Multidigits!
Does this mean you are feeling better now?
Glad you are, if so.
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