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Post by firstwd on Mar 6, 2015 19:59:18 GMT -5
All rifle rounds will go through a vest, including a 22. Pistol rounds are typically designed to move slower and are what vests are designed to stop.
Btw Woody, all broad heads will go through as well as knives and nails front a nail gun. That's why an advancing knife wielder within 25 feet becomes a bullet backstop.
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Post by swindianapaul on Mar 6, 2015 20:41:34 GMT -5
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Post by kevin1 on Mar 7, 2015 14:21:21 GMT -5
Mighty cocky of them...
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Post by trapperdave on Mar 7, 2015 20:24:12 GMT -5
I wonder if there is accurate data available detailing the number of LEO's that have been shot and wounded or killed with M855's ..... ? An AR is easily concealable under a trench coat or under a tarp in the bed of a truck. All depends on what ones definition of concealed is ...... even with that, you cant say the reason for the ban is to keep LEO's safe when very few, if any, have ever been shot and killed with the ammunition. Zero
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Post by jjas on Mar 10, 2015 15:53:00 GMT -5
www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/mar/9/atf-apologizes-error-ammo-ban-regulations/The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is apologizing for a “publishing error” in its regulations that suggested the agency had already banned AR-15 “green tip” ammo well before officials publicly announced a proposal to outlaw the armor-piercing bullets last month. “ATF has not rescinded any armor piercing ammunition exemption, and the fact they are not listed in the 2014 online edition of the regulations was an error which has no legal impact,” the agency said in a statement. “ATF apologizes for any confusion caused by this publishing error.” In January, the ATF published an online regulations guide that doesn’t contain a listing of the ammo exempted from a ban on armor piercing ammunition. By omitting the .223-caliber M855 ammo from the list, the agency led some to believe the government had already effectively banned it before the ATF’s announcement on Feb. 13 that it was seeking public comment on a proposal to do just that. The regulations come out about every 10 years and must be reviewed by the White House Office of Management and Budget. The discrepancy was first reported by Townhall.com.
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Post by drs on Mar 11, 2015 4:29:58 GMT -5
I heard that surplus military empty rifle & pistol cartridges are being ground-up and the brass is sold to Red China. Under Obama's orders, and kept out of the hands of citizens and those business that sell once fired re-manufactured ammunition, making .223 ammo and other types in short supply.
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Post by jjas on Mar 11, 2015 7:04:19 GMT -5
At this point it won't make a bit of difference what the "truth" is when it comes to this matter. The internet is abuzz and that ammo will be hard to find and the prices will skyrocket because of it.
Kind of like .22 rimfire..........
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Post by swilk on Mar 11, 2015 7:19:06 GMT -5
Funny how low information decisions snowball .... one low information person tells another low information person. That person tells 2 others. They each tell 3 others. Before you know it the low information grapevine is in full force and manipulating markets.
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Post by drs on Mar 11, 2015 8:17:22 GMT -5
At this point it won't make a bit of difference what the "truth" is when it comes to this matter. The internet is abuzz and that ammo will be hard to find and the prices will skyrocket because of it. Kind of like .22 rimfire.......... That's Obama & Company's plan using ammunition as a "Backdoor" to eliminate our second amendment rights. As for .22 rimfire ammo, I've not seen it for sale in our local Walmart going on for four years now. Other places are sold out too!! We ALL need to bring this to the attention of our elected officials and those running for office in 2016, if we still have a Country.
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Post by jjas on Mar 11, 2015 8:48:33 GMT -5
At this point it won't make a bit of difference what the "truth" is when it comes to this matter. The internet is abuzz and that ammo will be hard to find and the prices will skyrocket because of it. Kind of like .22 rimfire.......... That's Obama & Company's plan using ammunition as a "Backdoor" to eliminate our second amendment rights. As for .22 rimfire ammo, I've not seen it for sale in our local Walmart going on for four years now. Other places are sold out too!! We ALL need to bring this to the attention of our elected officials and those running for office in 2016, if we still have a Country. One of the men who works the firearms counter @ BassPro in Clarksville told me that (as a company) BassPro sold twice as much .22 ammo in 2014 than they did in 2013. So there really isn't a shortage. The factories are pumping out .22 ammo all the time. It's called supply and demand. WE are our own worst enemy in this situation. WE are hoarding ammo. WE have shown a willingness to support the cottage industry of ammo resale by paying exorbitant prices for .22s. And now that is going to occur with ALL .223 ammo as WE are going to hoard that now and WE are going to pay much higher prices than in the past because of simple supply and demand that will manifest itself as panic buying (just as it did with .22 rimfire).
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Post by drs on Mar 11, 2015 9:01:36 GMT -5
That's Obama & Company's plan using ammunition as a "Backdoor" to eliminate our second amendment rights. As for .22 rimfire ammo, I've not seen it for sale in our local Walmart going on for four years now. Other places are sold out too!! We ALL need to bring this to the attention of our elected officials and those running for office in 2016, if we still have a Country. One of the men who works the firearms counter @ BassPro in Clarksville told me that (as a company) BassPro sold twice as much .22 ammo in 2014 than they did in 2013. So there really isn't a shortage. The factories are pumping out .22 ammo all the time. It's called supply and demand. WE are our own worst enemy in this situation. WE are hoarding ammo. WE have shown a willingness to support the cottage industry of ammo resale by paying exorbitant prices for .22s. And now that is going to occur with ALL .223 ammo as WE are going to hoard that now and WE are going to pay much higher prices than in the past because of simple supply and demand that will manifest itself as panic buying (just as it did with .22 rimfire). What you wrote in you're post may well be correct, concerning ammunition. I just heard on the news that firearm purchases are way down, and many folks that hunt only averaged one firearm per household. Also, I never once thought that .22 rimfire ammo would be hard to find, or other types of rifle & pistol ammunition. Even during the Vietnam War years, there was never a shortage of ammunition. Also, I remember back in the late '70 - early 1980's ammo prices actual fell.
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Post by lawrencecountyhunter on Mar 11, 2015 9:35:14 GMT -5
There is a poster real similar to this hanging up in my local gunshop. Could be expanded to include ammunition as well. It sucks not being able to find cheap ammunition when you need it, but I think in general increased firearm sales, ammunition sales, NRA memberships, etc. is going to be good for us in the long run. Every time the left makes a go for our guns / ammo, it seems the push back is even stronger.
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Post by jjas on Mar 11, 2015 10:27:33 GMT -5
There is a poster real similar to this hanging up in my local gunshop. Could be expanded to include ammunition as well. It sucks not being able to find cheap ammunition when you need it, but I think in general increased firearm sales, ammunition sales, NRA memberships, etc. is going to be good for us in the long run. Every time the left makes a go for our guns / ammo, it seems the push back is even stronger. You would think so, but it can have the opposite effect. When people can't find ammo with regularity, they don't buy the firearms that utilize that ammo. Sales of .22 lr chambered firearms are down and with this mess with .223 ammo, I wonder if and/or when that ammo will become difficult to find to the point where sales that are already lagging will more or less, dry up.
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Post by lawrencecountyhunter on Mar 11, 2015 10:43:07 GMT -5
You would think so, but it can have the opposite effect. When people can't find ammo with regularity, they don't buy the firearms that utilize that ammo. Sales of .22 lr chambered firearms are down and with this mess with .223 ammo, I wonder if and/or when that ammo will become difficult to find to the point where sales that are already lagging will more or less, dry up. Makes sense that people would slow down on buying .22s since ammo is hard to find right now, so I'm not disputing that statement. But I would like to know where you saw that .22 sales were down? I've never seen a breakdown of firearms sales by caliber..
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Post by jjas on Mar 11, 2015 14:25:06 GMT -5
You would think so, but it can have the opposite effect. When people can't find ammo with regularity, they don't buy the firearms that utilize that ammo. Sales of .22 lr chambered firearms are down and with this mess with .223 ammo, I wonder if and/or when that ammo will become difficult to find to the point where sales that are already lagging will more or less, dry up. Makes sense that people would slow down on buying .22s since ammo is hard to find right now, so I'm not disputing that statement. But I would like to know where you saw that .22 sales were down? I've never seen a breakdown of firearms sales by caliber.. I'm basing my statement on what several dealers near me are saying. They are all telling me that sales of .22lr firearms are down by @ least 30 percent in their shops from a few years ago simply because they can't supply .22 ammo with regularity. One of the guys @ the local BassPro I know said he couldn't put a number on it, but said .22 firearms sales were down substantially there as well. UPDATE....I stopped in a lgs that I frequent and talked to the owner about sales of .22 chambered firearms and he told me his sales were down 80% from what they were before Newtown and the rush on .22 ammo.
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Post by jjas on Mar 11, 2015 15:40:54 GMT -5
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Post by dbd870 on Mar 12, 2015 6:19:10 GMT -5
The frenzy has died down.
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Post by jjas on Mar 20, 2015 21:30:08 GMT -5
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Post by drs on Mar 21, 2015 4:30:36 GMT -5
GOOD!! What they should do is eliminate the B.A.T.F.E. all together. This and those other "alphabet" groups like the: F.D.A., E.P.A., IRS, plus a few others. All have too much power that is currently infringing on our Bill Of Rights; everything from Gun Control, whether or not one can have a fireplace, or a grill for BBQ in OUR own back yards. ~ Just too much power to make stupid rules, making our live here in the U.S.A. more complicated. If the founding Fathers knew what was going on now days, they would be outraged!!
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Post by moose1am on Mar 25, 2015 8:08:57 GMT -5
I never thought Id see the day when 22 ammo couldnt be readily found. Nothing will surprise me now. I too never-ever though once that .22 LR ammunition would be in short supplies. Growing-up one could find .22 LR or any .22 Rimfire ammo anywhere, even in Grocery Stores!! During the Vietnam War, ammunition wasn't as hard to find as it is today. Interesting to note: all these shortages/restrictions began when Obama became our President. My question why doesn't Congress offer a solution to deal this mess. I think that when Obama was elected a lot of people got scared that he was in the White House. So they purchased guns and ammo in excess. This is what may have caused the shortages. The manufactures could not keep up with the new demands. And we had two wars going at one time in the past when Bush Jr was in office. The military used a lot of materials for the war. Brass and lead were being used more than normal to keep the military supplied with bullets. This too lead to the low supplies of ammo available to the civilian market.
I also think that a lot of people who are new tend to start out buying a 22 pistol or rifle as their first weapon. This increased the demand for 22 ammo. I've seen people with 22 auto shooting at the range all day long and going trough bricks of 22 LR ammo in one day. Then they go back to the store with friends and relatives and buy up all the ammo as soon as the store gets a new shipment in. These people go early in the morning to buy up all the ammo they can. This has to be one of the reasons we have a limited or no supply of 22 LR ammo in my area. I wish it were not so. I had to pay $70 for a Brick of 22 LR ammo last summer and won't shoot it all at once for fear or not being able to find anymore. I never bought 22 LR ammo by the Brick before. I always paid a couple dollars for a box of 50 shells in the past. I also don't shoot my 22 rifle very much and have only used it once or twice in the last 20 years.
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