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Post by steve46511 on Sept 22, 2014 15:59:03 GMT -5
Sure why not. You get one buck tag a yr. one dead deer, is one dead deer, not sure shooting one two weeks earlier should be a big issue. I really can't give a reason why not to allow it. I've been able to pattern some really good bucks in September that are gone come October, so I'd welcome Sept 15 start date for that fact alone. All being said , I could really care less either way. Not pointing this directly at you, RR, but when I read this I had a flash back of all the uproar that hit the web when an early season was discussed for ANY type of firearm. and how the replies differed from those given here for this opinion seeking thread. Would not all of your opinion's fact STILL BE ACCURATE? (This is presented intending this to be comical, not criticism.) Certain organizations (and certain individuals) would be screaming that "The Sky Is Falling" again. Forgive me if this seems offensive. I've had a REALLY bad weekend so maybe I'm in a bit of a "devil's advocate" frame of mind? Or maybe just made me even more of a PIA? LOL! As I said though, it just leaped to mind how WHAT weapon it is being suggested to be used as a in early season before archery season makes a world of difference to some (lots?). God Bless Steve
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Post by chubwub on Sept 22, 2014 16:17:08 GMT -5
I'm with other guys on this one, allowing people to harvest trophy bucks before they have a chance to breed seems to be the height of folly for a deer program that is focused on getting more trophy deer in the area. Also, maybe we should give the does with fawns at least a fighting chance to finish raising their young and get the spots off before we harvest them? I love the tender meat of a young deer quite a bit, but sometimes you have to let them walk! I just don't see the proposal of an extended season being sustainable right now in our state, and that's what deer management is all about, sustainability of the population.
Indiana has an extremely generous deer season as it is, especially if you have access to a deer reduction zone. I would say 3 months is more than enough time to kill a deer. It might not be that special trophy buck that will probably gut shot with a bow and left overnight in 70 degree weather to track the next day with a dog because all they about is the rack, but there are plenty of opportunities to fill your freezer with meat if you are not out for just a rack. I somewhat jest, but I see a LOT of trophy hunters in videos that do junk like this on their hunting shows. It really sours my opinion of trophy hunters on occasion.
I have had the privilege to hunt an urban zone in the past, my experience was this:
Extremely hot, bugs eat you alive, and the deer are harder to see because of all the foliage, plus they are easier to lose if you manage to stick one. I also didn't see as much activity compared to colder months to be honest because it was just so hot sometimes that nothing wanted to move until it was pretty dark out, and I sure as heck am not shooting a deer that I would have to wait until the morning to properly track with 60-50 degree nights. There are freakin burrs EVERYWHERE, they get stuck EVERYWHERE. Pollen count is high and you have a runny nose and you are sneezing constantly.
There are also a lot more non-hunting people running around and mowing, and are more apt to hike through the woods. I caught THREE people in one hunt trespassing onto our land that were simply passing though to take an autumn hike.
The extra time was nice, but just wasn't worth the hassle. The late season was so much better and enjoyable with the snow on the ground and everyone inside and gone.
I supposed if more time was to be added to harvest deer, I would rather see it added to February, as it would give the younguns more time with the mother to learn how to survive winter as opposed to killing a doe in the fall with fawns in tow that have yet to learn everything she can teach about survival. Another alternative could be to extend the season but reduce the amount of deer you could harvest as a compromise. If the focus of an early season HAS to be about that trophy buck, then fine, extend the fall season but only allow the harvesting of a buck.
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Post by stevein on Sept 22, 2014 16:29:57 GMT -5
I doubt harvesting a say 125" buck in September will have stopped him from passing his genes on. He has already had a couple of seasons to do so.
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Post by chubwub on Sept 22, 2014 16:36:08 GMT -5
I doubt harvesting a say 125" buck in September will have stopped him from passing his genes on. He has already had a couple of seasons to do so. No doubt he has already done so, but having 4 years of breeding chances is better than 3 years of breeding chances and so on.
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Post by mstr2175 on Sept 22, 2014 17:05:33 GMT -5
Sure why not. You get one buck tag a yr. one dead deer, is one dead deer, not sure shooting one two weeks earlier should be a big issue. I really can't give a reason why not to allow it. I've been able to pattern some really good bucks in September that are gone come October, so I'd welcome Sept 15 start date for that fact alone. All being said , I could really care less either way. This is invalid for the simple fact that many hunters go without even getting a buck some seasons. That is two extra weeks for them to have a chance to tag their bucks. Afterall...they are just that much easier to pattern in September.
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Post by GS1 on Sept 22, 2014 18:39:20 GMT -5
This is invalid for the simple fact that many hunters go without even getting a buck some seasons. That is two extra weeks for them to have a chance to tag their bucks. Afterall...they are just that much easier to pattern in September. With the current days afield available, if a guy doesn't get "a" buck, two extra weeks aren't going to help that much. What it may help is the guy that doesn't get "the" buck he wants during the current setup.
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Post by boonechaser on Sept 22, 2014 19:30:38 GMT -5
Children, SEASON OPENS in a few days and we can do away with these what if's and would you support posts and can actually concentrate on Deer hunting!!!! Good luck to all, remember to check those tree steps, climbing sticks and straps and cables on your lock on stands, and most importantly remember to WEAR YOUR SAFETY vest or strap.
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Post by coldwaterchaser on Sept 22, 2014 19:46:49 GMT -5
NO September
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Post by mstr2175 on Sept 22, 2014 19:59:30 GMT -5
This is invalid for the simple fact that many hunters go without even getting a buck some seasons. That is two extra weeks for them to have a chance to tag their bucks. Afterall...they are just that much easier to pattern in September. With the current days afield available, if a guy doesn't get "a" buck, two extra weeks aren't going to help that much. What it may help is the guy that doesn't get "the" buck he wants during the current setup. These are two extra weeks where the level of activity is being compared to the rut. From what I have seen, there are a lot of hunters (probably the majority) that only get to hunt a few times a year and when they do it is during the rut. In all honesty, I do agree that two weeks would not make much of a difference... I have just heard it being compared to the rut a lot on this thread.
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Post by tynimiller on Sept 23, 2014 7:42:38 GMT -5
I would just like to point out the obvious when it comes to genes being passed on by trophy bucks....which some have voiced a concern for in their opposition stance on opening up the season earlier.
Whether a deer is a 170 inch 7 year old or a 35 inch yearling....their genes are the exact same. There is no special food plot mix or water formula or day count before their genes start changing....
....therefore as you may know remove a buck from a herd and other bucks will gladly take over the does he would have bred, as no doe that is in estrous goes without being bred I bet unless in special areas devoid of much of a population of deer (not a normal thing here in IN).
I don't say this because I'm for the earlier season...I am merely pointing this out in that claiming the breeding thing doesn't necessarily hold water completely 100%...is it possible a mature buck is taken with great genes and some not-so-genetically inclined bucks breed a few does because of it? Sure...but might I also remind you that many researchers and biologists have found far more bucks have genes capable of P&Y by age 5 than don't...the simple fact is some just take to full maturity to really start showing "trophy" caliber horns (which is opinion based at best).
While a deer may not have the genes to be a 170...by age 5 if he's just a 115 inch buck he is a trophy in my mind and should be for anyone else.
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Post by whitetail1 on Sept 23, 2014 20:07:18 GMT -5
I doubt harvesting a say 125" buck in September will have stopped him from passing his genes on. He has already had a couple of seasons to do so. No doubt he has already done so, but having 4 years of breeding chances is better than 3 years of breeding chances and so on. If that buck is shot on October 15th instead of September 15th, chances are he hasn't passed on those genes that year anyway.
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Post by stevein on Sept 23, 2014 20:50:40 GMT -5
I would just like to point out the obvious when it comes to genes being passed on by trophy bucks....which some have voiced a concern for in their opposition stance on opening up the season earlier. Whether a deer is a 170 inch 7 year old or a 35 inch yearling....their genes are the exact same. There is no special food plot mix or water formula or day count before their genes start changing.... ....therefore as you may know remove a buck from a herd and other bucks will gladly take over the does he would have bred, as no doe that is in estrous goes without being bred I bet unless in special areas devoid of much of a population of deer (not a normal thing here in IN). I don't say this because I'm for the earlier season...I am merely pointing this out in that claiming the breeding thing doesn't necessarily hold water completely 100%...is it possible a mature buck is taken with great genes and some not-so-genetically inclined bucks breed a few does because of it? Sure...but might I also remind you that many researchers and biologists have found far more bucks have genes capable of P&Y by age 5 than don't...the simple fact is some just take to full maturity to really start showing "trophy" caliber horns (which is opinion based at best). While a deer may not have the genes to be a 170...by age 5 if he's just a 115 inch buck he is a trophy in my mind and should be for anyone else. I agree with you that the genes are pretty much the same. BUT For a long time the bucks in the area I hunted had two types of racks. One spread out wide the other would almost touch at the tips. Over a period of time the wide rack bucks seemed to dominate. I always wondered about the genes of these deer.
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Post by ms660 on Sept 24, 2014 11:05:56 GMT -5
I miss the old 10-15 start date That was perfect imo I may be wrong but I always thought it was the second Saturday in Oct. that archery started. Back then I trapped fox and coyotes hard and that season always starts on the 15th and sometimes I got to hunt some before I set traps
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Post by shouldernuke on Sept 24, 2014 16:17:10 GMT -5
I miss the old 10-15 start date That was perfect imo I may be wrong but I always thought it was the second Saturday in Oct. that archery started. Back then I trapped fox and coyotes hard and that season always starts on the 15th and sometimes I got to get my line set before archery started It was .Indeed Direct from the From the 1989 hunting guide I just pulled out of the box since it was on top .. Bow season started that year Oct 7th {FYI the earliest bow could open was the 7th} it closed Nov 10th and then re-opened Dec 2nd and You had to wear orange the next two weeks because ML was in . FYI the latest bow could open was Oct 14th . FYI bow season limit was two deer ,two antlerless ,or a single buck and a antlerless deer that year in archery they could both be taken in early or late season . Gun was 1 antlered buck only it opened that year on Nov. 11 and closed Nov. 26th all deer season were out 5 days then ML opened up same days as late Archery and a hunter could take a deer of either sex if he had not taken a buck in the gun season otherwise he had to take a antlerless doe . FYI there were a few counties that had bonus antlerless permits that year and they had to be drawn and were good only in the county that they were issued for and had to be used in Gun season or ML season only ..It said as I just read it that they were not legal to use in any archery season ..LOL Times change for sure .. Deer season closed Dec. 31 a
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Post by Deleted on Sept 26, 2014 17:38:00 GMT -5
The Youth Season starts this weekend, and the conditions such as weather, snakes, amount of bugs out, will be basically the same as they have been the last 10 days.
The conditions during the first week of October, are generally the same as the last 10 days of September. So if you can hunt the Youth Weekend at the end of September, and if you can hunt and enjoy the first week of October, then you can hunt and enjoy the last week or two weeks of September in my opinion. The temperatures and conditions are basically the same.
Hunting early mornings and late evenings over or near food sources is productive in September. This is because the Deer are often in their Summer feeding patterns. The behavior and feeding patterns hunters see in person or on their Trail Cams throughout the summer, often is still regularly occurring into September. This is why hundreds of thousands of hunters in other states harvest Bucks and Does in or around Soybean Fields and other food sources each year in the month of September.
If you are regularly watching a mature Buck during the summer come to the same Soybean Field or Food plot every single evening, then chances are the Buck will be doing the exact same thing during the first few weeks of September. So if you hunt that Soybean Field or Food Plot in September, you have a good chance of seeing that Buck, because he is still in his Summer feeding pattern and he is feeding in the same areas at the same times he has all summer.
By October most crops are cut, so deer patterns change around food sources, often making them much harder to pattern and harvest. Most Bucks have lost their Velvet, making them less social, and more likely to split out of groups. They become almost more territorial, and seem to stay more back in the woods in daylight hours.
By November, things can start getting good again. Bucks are up looking for Does because of the rut. This can be by far the most exciting time to hunt, because you never know what you may see. At a moments notice a mature Buck can come into range from any direction. This is when the most Bucks are taken each year.
In December and January the Deer seem to once again focus on food sources near thick bedding areas. If you have a good food source, or fields with standing crops in December or January the hunting can be excellent. You can actually see more deer over food sources in these two months over most any month of the year besides September.
I think if the Indiana Statewide Archery Season started on September 15th, it would simply provide more opportunities to those that choose to hunt then. If you don't want to hunt then, you wouldn't have to. You could simply choose to hunt in October or whenever you want. But for those that may want to put meat in their freezer a few weeks earlier each season, or for those that want a chance at a Velvet Buck on their hunting property then this would provide those people with the opportunity. In my opinion, more opportunity is a good thing.
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Post by boonechaser on Sept 26, 2014 21:24:06 GMT -5
Using that logic then why not Aug 1st or July 1st?? Heck, why not all year long? We already have over 3 months of deer hunting!!!! Our deer herd is on the decline in most area's, so opening earlier makes no sense from the management side. Back to the "I WANT", "I WANT" thing. As Dr. Spak would say "Highly illogical" captain. JMO
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Post by familytradition on Sept 27, 2014 14:27:28 GMT -5
I hunt the urban zone, mature buck only guy, and I hate September. It is too hot and buggy. I have real ethics problems shooting a deer with archery equipment that may have sit out in the heat over night, because we all know long recoveries do happen. The only reason to hunt September is so guys can pattern and shoot that big buck before their neighbor does or because shooting one in velvet would be cool. Hunting this early is wrong and against tradition in my opinion. I support October 15th and would prefer a shorter bow season all around. I think our deer get hunted to hard.
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Post by tynimiller on Sept 29, 2014 7:50:53 GMT -5
I hunt the urban zone, mature buck only guy, and I hate September. It is too hot and buggy. I have real ethics problems shooting a deer with archery equipment that may have sit out in the heat over night, because we all know long recoveries do happen. The only reason to hunt September is so guys can pattern and shoot that big buck before their neighbor does or because shooting one in velvet would be cool. Hunting this early is wrong and against tradition in my opinion. I support October 15th and would prefer a shorter bow season all around. I think our deer get hunted to hard.I was with ya till this....hunting early isn't wrong. It may have more negatives than positives in your opinion and others but you cannot state it as wrong. Also tradition...um...justifying doing something simply because it's how it always been is a losing fight. I have learned that in my stance on rifles being allowed...sometimes things change and in some cases it is needed. Also you believe our deer get hunted too hard yet you want to take days away from bowhunting. I completely get the idea but it is without a shadow of a doubt known that more pressure is exerted on our deer during our longer than most other state's firearm season than during bow hunting. It is true there are areas where you see a large chunk of bowhunters present, however I'll also state that just a person hunting isn't the same amount of pressure as another person hunting. By nature bowhunters are tested and typically (do not construe any of this guys, I"m not saying all are) bowhunters are more worried about scent, access/entrance trails and such due to the close proximity of shot required. As an example I could hunt my one of my places I hunt everyday for the entire season and I guarantee you the deer wouldn't notice me nearly as much as opening day of firearm season on the adjacent property when their two guys hit the woods. It is all relative and far too many aspects or things play a factor...I for one would be cool with an earlier season like I've stated, BUT I AM SICK OF CHANGES EVERY SINGLE YEAR. Just stinking leave it alone for 3-4 years and let's actually judge whether what we've done can be measured good or bad. We change so many things that you can narrow down studies to one changed aspect because we have tons....let's just settle for few years on thinking changes must be made.
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Post by jackryan on Oct 2, 2014 22:54:49 GMT -5
I miss the old 10-15 start date That was perfect imo I'll agree with that. Half the people who hunt QUIT the day after they start any way and half of the rest quit the day after the next time they go. There's no reason to start opening the season when it's still hitting 95 - 100 degrees most of the time. I've got a feeling the people who are asking for this don't spend much time in the woods that time of year. Only July and August could be much more miserable not to mention it's pretty much peak tick season for the year.
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Post by jackryan on Oct 2, 2014 22:57:53 GMT -5
I don't think bow hunters need any more time. If any thing I think the youth season should be from September 15 till October 1 that way you don't only have 2 days to rush if the weather is bad or work stops you from taking them to enjoy learning about the traditions we learned and love so much. And that is just my 2 cents after raising 6 kids. Nothing is stopping you from taking your kids hunting from Oct 1 to Jan 31 or more. If any thing these hokey youth seasons should be eliminated entirely.
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